Start a new topic

Stats Display on Mobiles - Part II

Hi all,


iOS Beta 1.08 and Android Beta 54 brought in the initial work on this.


I want to try to bring the discussion together as not to keep iOS and Android separate.


The initial feedback is the Stats is heading in the right direction. However I see one large issue that we haven't covered - the Information Bar.


On the mobiles currently, if you tap on a route, you get some information at the top of the screen - distance, height gain etc. Its the same as on PC / macOS.


In many ways, I was just thinking we lose that, and replace it with the new stats bar. BUT, the Information Bar is in fact a little intelligent. It decides what to show due to what you have selected. Tap on a waypoint, it won't try to show you distance. It contrast you would set the Stats bar up to show a Distance box, then it would just show blank when a waypoint was selected.


So lets just stick with Distance for the moment.


You could select Distance in the new Stats bar. Then when you tap on a route, you would see the distance. Well that works.

But what if you are also recording a tracklog? Do we therefore tap on the tracklog to make it active? That seems to work also. Although I see the support issue here of 'I was seeing my tracklog distance and then it stopped' - yes because you tapped on a waypoint or something, and didn't re-select the tracklog being recorded!


The alternative is we have Distance (selected item), and Tracklog Distance as different items in stats, but then you will most likely need different setups for the Stats displays.


We can easily list


Distance

Tracklog Distance

Tracklog Current Segment Distance


Very easy to define these, but accessing them through the Stats window feels a bit awkward if you want to keep looking at different information - although that would fill out the full panel view mode of stats.


Other alternatives are to move the Information Bar information above the buttons at the bottom, and like the PC, make it transient. i.e. you select something, it becomes visible, and then goes, and make this an option in Settings.



At the moment, I'm thinking to have

Distance

Tracklog Distance

Tracklog Current Segment Distance


At times Distance will be the same as Tracklog Distance, but at least there is no ambiguity of what is selected.



Thoughts?


Graham


Hi Graham,

My experience with other navigation software is that distance travelled is always available, not necessarily always visible, without having to tap on the track.  That would solve the problem of tapping on "the wrong thing".  I wonder if the "intelligent" information bar is trying to be a bit too clever?

Peter

@Peter - very possibly, although its worked nicely on the desktops, but then desktops aren't mobiles!


One more thought - OMNC - everything in the stats bar was either derived from the Phone itself (things like time), the GPS (current position, speed), or statistics from the recording tracklog (Distance, average speed). At NO point did the stats bar access anything to do with other GPX information. Possibly we should just keep that distinction. Stats for items on the GPX can be got in the info screens in the GE, and CURRENTLY using the Information Bar.

I'm a bit confused on this Graham. Distance to me is the distance you have traveled so far whilst walking. This is quite different from the length of a route you have plotted or a track you have previously walked. If I understand you it seems you trying to combine both into stats which to me is confusing.


Surely the info bar gives info on a plotted route or walked track (i.e. historic, static, already done) whist the stats strip & display gives info on what you are currently doing (i.e. distance travelled, height gained, average speed etc). To my mind they are different and both are important. So retain both since they offer different sorts of information.


Currently the info bar sits over the data strip but since it is translucent and difficult to read. 2 possibilities:-

1. shift it down so it lies under the data strip then make a top margin on the full stats so no text underlies it.

2. leave it where it is but make it opaque (yellow?).


I prefer 1, 2 looks messy.


Maybe I'm missing something here and I haven't quite understood you intensions.


Tony

Hi again - maybe your last post Graham alludes to what I'm saying.


Tony

Hi Graham,

Been pondering about this one. So I have my route defined and I can view it in GE, I can see it on the map, I can set a tracklog to see where I've been.

 If I use my handheld GPS(Garmin) I would have to select "Navigate" to get meaningful stats on my route. Then distance has meaning in that context, How far have I come, how far to the next waypoint. If I deviate I can always recalculate. If I want to reverse a route the handheld sorts that out too.

With omn what is distance relative to? the last time I switched on gps?  the start of the route that is open in GE? what if there are a couple of routes open in ge? 

So unless you have Navigate option to follow a track then the only thing you really have to use is tracklog data. So then, if I'm following a route how can you give guidance on distance/direction to next waypoint unless I tell you what I'm doing.

Dennis

comments crossed, I see both you and Tony eluding to the same thing...

Hi Graham,

Would it be possible to link a tap on an element i.e. point, route or track,
to an element stats configuration, say pointstats, routestats, trackstats
where the user can configure what they want to see for each element type.
Something like,

     element             configuration       items displayed
     point                   pointstats              item1, ....., item m
     route                   routestats             item1, ...., item n
     track                   trackstats              item1, ..., item k

Perhaps, adding a level of indirection, where there user could set up
several configurations for each element type and pre-select which
configuration should be displayed for an element type. For example,
a user might set up the following configurations

  Element       UserConfig_A        UserConfig_B         UserConfig_C
  point            my_pointstats_a      my_pointstats_b       my_pointstats_c
  route            my_routestats_a     my_routestats_b       my_routestats_c
  track            my_trackstats_a      my_trackstats_b       my_trackstats_c

and, on a particular day, might select the following configurations for
display

     Canonical     UserConfig
     pointstats     my_pointstats_b
     routestats     my_routestats_c
     trackstats     my_trackstats_a

Regards,
Paul Whitfield

 

Hi Graham, Been walking and playing with the data strip today to get a feel for using it in practice. I wonder if the control could be simplified. Just tap along the top of the screen to reveal it and tap anywhere in it to hide it. It’s intuitive and would remove the need for a button. Swipe down etc remains as is. Simple but effective. Tony
I quite like the info provided by the "info" bar and also the "stats" bar. As long as there is a clear distinction as to what I'm looking at I think they can coexist. Maybe an option from the double tap? Different background colour? I'm not keen on having to delve into the GE. Why is there no 'see info' when you long press a route / point / track?
Would prefer to keep both. The Info bar I find very useful similarly the Stats bar. I have no problems with the method of viewing or selecting the options on the Stats bar.
 I'm not a fan of "Swiping" since I seem to have fingers that screens do not always respond to. (OMN C is bad for this) and yes I do have a "Fake finger" which does help, provided I have it with me.
Cliff

 

Hi all,

 

Sorry for the very late replies on this one.

 

@Dennis – I think the stats view at the top ONLY relates to the GPS information (current location, altitude) and the currently recording tracklog. Currently we only have one stat on the tracklog which is Distance, but we will add others such as ascent, descent, average speed etc.


@Paul – whilst I can see where you are going with this idea, its going to be too complex for most users, and would likely confuse more than it resolves any issues is my thinking.


@Tony – I’ve been playing with it more as well, and I’m starting to think we should move the button bottom left. Tap to open, tap to close. Tap once on the stats bar to expand/once to contract. Double tap to select as now. Keeps it all very simple.


@Steve – ‘see info’ as a long press option makes sense.


@Cliff – many thanks.

 

Graham

Hi Graham,

I suggested a configuration files option since you seemed to be considering scrapping the Info
bar and incorporating it into the new Stats bar/screen and your concern that the "lack of intelligence"
of the Stats bar/screen might mean that some of the data fields would be empty, depending on which
entity (track, route, waypoint) you tapped on on the map. If default configuration files were set up for
each entity then the configuration files would become the "intelligence" and they would, in general, be
hidden from the user. However, as the "intelligence" is not done on the fly, it does have the advantage
that it would be possible to allow the user to modify the configuration files to display the data fields they
want to see for each entity and this would likely be a one off task, a bit like setting Styles. If no entity
(track, route,waypoint) has been selected on the map, then the Stats bar/screen would display the
general data fields as it does presently. Hopefully, from a coding point of view, it would be fairly
straightforward to adjust the number of fields, depending on which entity was selected, so that there
were no empty data fields.

The configuration files option means that configuration files can be used to display the entity stats
in the Info bar or in the Stats bar/screen. So, why not add an option to allow the user to decide where
to display the entity stats, i.e. in the Info bar or in the Sats bar/screen; both have their advantages -
nice big text in the Stats bar/screen for those whose visual acuity is not what it used to be (me!),
separation and immediacy of entity stats in the Info bar. By default, keep the status quo and display
the entity stats in the Info bar.

I don't think the above is too complex, and would seem quite flexible, or did you mean that the
coding would be too complex?

I would agree that adding a level of indirection is probably a step too far.

Regards,
Paul Whitfield

 

@Paul - I think I set off this conversation through my own in-decisiveness. I was thinking the information bar and stats bar were the same thing, and the clearly are not. I also think having the info bar match the desktops is correct, and stats is therefore all about the GPS and device information. I think the distinction is clear.  Sometimes the code is complex, other times its quite simple, but the result ends up difficult to explain to users, or is used by so few people that we just spend a lot of time writing easy configuration code that only a handful of people use, in which case, its probably wasted development time when I know I need to get Send to GPS done on the PC! 


I think the stats bar is now taking shape. The information bar I think works, but needs better/clearer formatting on mobiles.


I think we are into the tidy-up stage, before we start to add further data fields to the stats bar.


Thanks,


Graham

Login to post a comment